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philpridd
10-07-2010, 05:40
Hello everyone,thought these pics might be of interest.They are the only military buildings left, most of the remaining airfield site is now a business park,so dont think it will be long before we lose these as well. Phil.
http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae300/philpridd/DSCF0181.jpg
http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae300/philpridd/DSCF0177.jpg
http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae300/philpridd/DSCF0175.jpg
Can anyone tell me the purpose of the void between the armour plate and rear wall? There are 2 access hatches 1 in the side wal,and 1 in the rear, both rusted solid.
http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae300/philpridd/DSCF0171.jpg
http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae300/philpridd/DSCF0173.jpg
http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae300/philpridd/DSCF0195.jpg
http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae300/philpridd/DSCF0192.jpg
http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae300/philpridd/DSCF0191.jpg
http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae300/philpridd/DSCF0211.jpg
http://i981.photobucket.com/albums/ae300/philpridd/DSCF0216.jpg

PETERTHEEATER
10-07-2010, 07:49
Images 1 through 5 appear to be the Shooting-in Butt; the armour plate at the rear was the 'backstop'. The butt would have been filled with sand with a natural slope top-rear to bottom front.

http://wtp2.appspot.com/wheresthepath.htm?lat=53.34060118576442&lon=-2.8758805990219116&gz=19&oz=7&gt=1

Last time that I saw it there was the top section of a Pickett-Hamilton adjacent.

canberra
10-07-2010, 09:02
Was there actually an RAF Speke? Yes there was Speke airport and there were RAF aircraft based there for a while, but was there an RAF Speke?

philpridd
10-07-2010, 13:24
According to my research,via google, the military presence at speke had grown to such an extent,that that early in the war the airport was taken over by the R.A.F. I may have misinterpreted this as .'R.A.F ' Speke, if so,sorry.However as military aircraft assembly took place on the site,and with an adjacent aircraft shadow factory also using the site, I cannot imagine that in time of war,the site would be allowed to continue to function as a civilian airport.There were operational R.A.F. sqaudrons on site,as well as the aircraft assembly activities. If anyone can find out please let me know.I found that the information brought up was rather sketchy in this respect,though it does cover the military wartime use of the site. Cheers,Phil.

philpridd
10-07-2010, 13:38
Hi Canberra, see wikapedia, john lennon airport, page down to history section,click on rootes aircraft factory, it says that the airport was taken over by the r.a.f. and known as r.a.f. Speke, dont know what the 'official' definition of an r.a.f. base is,but thats good enough for me! chhers, Phil.

canberra
10-07-2010, 13:48
Yes there were civil flights at Speke throughout wwii, they went to Eire and the Isle of Man.

And you may be correct about RAF Station Speke, there is no such thing as an RAF "base" anymore. The only Commonwealth nations to still use the term are Australia and Canada.

And for your education an RAF station has a Station Headquarters (SHQ) and of course a Station Commander, usually referred to as the Commanding Officer or CO. Only a station in the RAF has a CO.

philpridd
10-07-2010, 16:35
Thanks Peter, but do you know what was behind the armour plate,that is in the space between the plate and thertsets rear wall.They must have needed access to the space, because there are two small hatches,one in the rear wall.(see pic.),and one at the rear of the side wall. They are not big enough for a man to get through,so I dont think they were used in the construction.Under the hatch in the rear wall,there are 2 support brackets at the base of the wall,almost as though some some sort of hopper or container was there. If the sand collected the bullets,and the armour plate stopped the bullets from penetrating into the space behind,why would anyone need access to that space.The brackets at the base of the hatch in the rear wall,made me wonder if something had to be collected at regular intervals,or was there some sort of alignment target,that was run up and down as in rifle firing butts. Its certainly got me baffled. Any info.appreciated,Thanks, Phil. p.s. the pickett-hamilton you mentioned has gone

philpridd
10-07-2010, 16:51
Ok, thanks,more complicated than what I thought,still someone must have been in charge of the r.a.f units,and wikapedia does state that the airport was taken over by the r.a.f (their words,not mine)so whoever was in charge,must have been the station commander,anyway thats my reasoning,but till some definitive evidence comes up,have to leave it at that.One thing though,without a station commander,who decides priorities regarding raf/civilian operations.?One would think that raf needs would overede civilian ones, anyway whoever was in charge,and whether it was an official raf base or not,thanks for your help,pity we cant speak to any ex raf personnell who were there in the war. Cheers.

PETERTHEEATER
11-07-2010, 06:48
Thanks Peter, but do you know what was behind the armour plate,that is in the space between the plate and thertsets rear wall.They must have needed access to the space, because there are two small hatches,one in the rear wall.(see pic.),and one at the rear of the side wall. They are not big enough for a man to get through,so I dont think they were used in the construction.Under the hatch in the rear wall,there are 2 support brackets at the base of the wall,almost as though some some sort of hopper or container was there. If the sand collected the bullets,and the armour plate stopped the bullets from penetrating into the space behind,why would anyone need access to that space.The brackets at the base of the hatch in the rear wall,made me wonder if something had to be collected at regular intervals,or was there some sort of alignment target,that was run up and down as in rifle firing butts. Its certainly got me baffled. Any info.appreciated,Thanks, Phil. p.s. the pickett-hamilton you mentioned has gone

I really don't know. It is possible that the void was filled with gravel. How thick is the metal plate and does it extend all the way to the floor? Some cannon butts had a deflector plate of armour steel sloped at 45 degrees and a tank underneath filled with water into which deflected projectiles were caught. Consequently, the scrap had to be emptied periodically. In the absence of construction drawings I can only speculate as top the purpose of the access doors and apertures.

philpridd
11-07-2010, 08:19
OK,thanks,dont know how thick the plating is,goes down to floor but does not appear to be angled.Someone has tried chipping a hole in the brickwork under the sidewall access hatch,but it does n't go all the way through,tried putting camera up to it,but all that showed on flash was blackness.There appears to be a ledge at the top of plating,but as there are small trees growing from it, or the void goes all the way down and has filled up over the years.Anyway thanks for your help,when I fist saw it, I thought it was some type of water or fuel tank,with the access hatches used to fill and empty it,though I couldnt understand why it should be vertical. Have never come across one before,so was quite taken aback on finding its true purpose!Cant understand how it survived,when all other buildings have been demolished.daresay it wont be long before it goes the same way though.Thanks for all your help.not just with this, but also (as I mistakenly thought) the 'air raid' shelters on m40. Tere is an identical firing butt at Duxford,so will try contacting them,good excuse to fit in an extra air show. Cheers.

PETERTHEEATER
11-07-2010, 10:24
There were several pattern (Drawings) for Shooting-in Butts, the Speke version appears to be one of the more elaborate. Just found this one at Castletown, Scotland; the aircraft hard standing is on the opposite side of the raod if you rotate the view.

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=CASTLETOWN,+SCOTLAND&sll=53.409033,-3.077631&sspn=0.005564,0.013797&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Castletown,+Thurso,+Caithness,+United+Kingdo m&ll=58.5885,-3.35804&spn=0.004361,0.027595&t=h&z=15&layer=c&cbll=58.5885,-3.358028&panoid=oeK4u9H41ghYasWL7Oz7sQ&cbp=11,30.28,,0,8.5

philpridd
11-07-2010, 23:28
Thanks.that must be the 'back to basics' version,I thought they would all be the same design,obviously not.There is one at Duxford whch is identical to the one at Speke. Cheers.

PETERTHEEATER
12-07-2010, 07:14
What is the location of the Duxford example?

P Bellamy
12-07-2010, 19:59
Duxfords's: Flash Earth (http://www.flashearth.com/?lat=52.095418&lon=0.131525&z=20&r=0&src=msl)

All the best,
PB

PETERTHEEATER
13-07-2010, 08:00
Thanks Paul, just too obvious for my eyesight! Looks to be in good shape.

leelad03
05-10-2010, 20:59
Can someone tell me the wareabouts of the 2 pillboxes? I had been to have a quick look at the butt today!
Thanks
#Lee

PETERTHEEATER
06-10-2010, 03:55
There was one here but it's gone now according to Street View:

http://wtp2.appspot.com/wheresthepath.htm?lat=53.34873087709757&lon=-2.885812819004059&gz=19&oz=8&gt=1

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Liverpool,+United+Kingdom&sll=52.721298,-0.902685&sspn=0.02381,0.055189&g=Great+Dalby,+Melton+Mowbray,+Leicestershire,+Uni ted+Kingdom&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Liverpool,+United+Kingdom&ll=53.34874,-2.886086&spn=0.000331,0.001725&t=h&z=19&layer=c&cbll=53.348808,-2.886079&panoid=ZJr4NjDdd1Z05oxIfwBmUA&cbp=11,118.06,,0,4.64

tigger
06-10-2010, 09:10
Can someone tell me the wareabouts of the 2 pillboxes?

Not sure what you mean Lee? Very few, if any, pillboxes left in Liverpool now. DoB shows several that have been destroyed and the local HER lists a few more. The following site might be of interest if you are interested in WWII artifacts in the area: http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/ww2defences/

The defensive positions photographed in the OP are in the woods adjacent to the butts and you probably walked right past them.

Lt Cmdr ( A )
06-10-2010, 11:51
Reference your enquiry about Speke Airfield. Living only a matter of some 5 miles from Speke I have made enquiries and found out the following if it is of any help. Speke Airport was requistioned by the Ministry of War in Sptember 1939 and named R.A.F. Speke. It was occupied by 24 Hampdens of 64 & 144 Squadrons at the end of September, it remained in R.A.F Control until the 10th July 1944, when it was handed over to the control of the Directorate of Civil Aviation although a Military presence was kept their until May 10th 1946 with the departure of the Spitfires of 811 Squadsron to nearby Woodvale. in the 1950's Air Works had a maintenance base at Speke overhauling Vampires and Sabres for the R.A.F and NATO, so tecnically the Military pulled out of Speke in the 1950's. The Government kept control of Speke until January 1961 when it was handed back to Liverpool Corporation.

Robin
06-10-2010, 17:46
I visited Speke a number of times in the late 1950s with the Merseyside Group of Aviation Enthusiasts, MGAE, and remember the hangars crowded with RAF Sabres, the Squadron markings were great.

I do wish people would use the correct 'case' for words. It is Royal Air Force Speke, or RAF Speke. Please refrain from using 'textspeak'.

Robin.

canberra
06-10-2010, 18:11
Is your complaint about RAF or R.A.F??? When I was a lad it was the practice to use periods in abbreviations.

Carnaby
06-10-2010, 19:31
I do wish people would use the correct 'case' for words. It is Royal Air Force Speke, or RAF Speke.
I'm with you on that Robin.

Regarding using stops in abbreviations, it's been the practice for quite some time now to omit them (New Hart's Rules / The Oxford Guide to Style). I'm also happy with that one - makes writing less cluttered. The TNA is extremely inconsistent with RAF, R.A.F. and R A F, for example - beware when using their search engine.

The 'rules' are complex, but generally a stop is used on a truncated word, e.g. Prof. for Professor, but not in a contraction - if the final letter is correct, e.g. Dr for Doctor. However Street becomes St. to differentiate it from St for Saint.

To be honest it gets very very tedious obeying these rules as exceptions keep appearing. I'm going to the pub :roll:.

Graham

hydealfred
06-10-2010, 20:28
I'm with you on that Robin.

Regarding using stops in abbreviations, it's been the practice for quite some time now to omit them (New Hart's Rules / The Oxford Guide to Style). I'm also happy with that one - makes writing less cluttered. The TNA is extremely inconsistent with RAF, R.A.F. and R A F, for example - beware when using their search engine.

The 'rules' are complex, but generally a stop is used on a truncated word, e.g. Prof. for Professor, but not in a contraction - if the final letter is correct, e.g. Dr for Doctor. However Street becomes St. to differentiate it from St for Saint.

To be honest it gets very very tedious obeying these rules as exceptions keep appearing. I'm going to the pub :roll:.

Graham

Think I'll come with you !!

ted angus
06-10-2010, 22:44
In 1964 I joined the R.A.F. at R.A.F. Station Locking, when I got the bullet in 2004 I was discharged at RAF Leuchars.
The correct method of addressing an RAF formation is in JSP 101 and the RAF postal directory. The word Station or Unit
was alway inserted before the name, but rarely appears now. . A location must be self accounting before getting Station status. In addition to Harts Rules the Services have always had a massive publication plus annexes and addendums (spelling) which dictate the convention used by the individual Services. Much of it followed civillian convention but there were differences. Spelling to be adopted was detailed as a particular edition of the Concise Oxford Dictionary.

Robin
06-10-2010, 22:55
Mine is a pint of Spitfire, cheers.

Robin.

ted angus
06-10-2010, 23:30
Mine is a pint of Spitfire, cheers.

Robin.

Downed all over Kent just like the Luftwaffe !!

TED

Robin
07-10-2010, 09:47
Downed all over Kent just like the Luftwaffe !!

TED

Hi Ted.

Just remember, they are now our allies.

Robin.

ted angus
07-10-2010, 10:21
Hi Ted.

Just remember, they are now our allies.

Robin.
Yes and having worked with all NATO allies They and the Canadians are the best to work with, The Dutch and Danes are great but tended to lack ungency, The Belgiums only worked day shift, The Italians will blame anyone convienient for their mistakes. I won't continue. I was Taceval DI staff for 2 years and served under a German Colonel top man !!
But I couldn't cope with the schnapps at breakfast needed a shot of Gavescon after it

TED

bvs
18-02-2011, 07:54
Talking of Speke,this thread on key a while ago got interesting,split into 2 camps - I was most definitely in the 'Ground Collision' camp,we speculated it might have been a ground collision between the F5 (P thirty eight) and a production Halifax !
Anybody know anything about the incident ??
cannot post pic today but it is on post number 4

rgds baz

http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/showthread.php?t=96614&highlight=ground+collision+speke

bvs
04-06-2011, 06:31
Just to prod this thread again for any info regarding this photo,but please read relevant posts on this Key thread before any comments ;) (post 11 onwards)

http://forum.keypublishing.co.uk/showthread.php?t=96614&highlight=ground+collision+speke

http://i695.photobucket.com/albums/vv316/volvosmoker/3968644495_3e028c6482_b.jpg

Fred Dobie
23-08-2011, 13:07
I live in Speke and was having a look around this area with my son a couple of days ago. As kids we used to play around here, and as it was always a remote part of the airfield our trespasses went unnoticed most of the time. The "Shooting-in Butt" is still there, but I have seen this type of building described as an engine testing shed. I remember there used to be a steel girder framework inside the shed which I assumed supported the engines under test. The steel shutters were to allow fumes out? Granted, there are bullet-like pockmarks on the wall to the right of the opening but I don't remember if they were there when I was young. In the 1960s there used to be an old Hawker Hunter dumped just beyond this building, used by the airport firefighters for training. The Pickett-Hamilton referred to was also one of our playthings, but was removed a couple of years ago. It has been placed at the rear of the old airport building (now a hotel) where the dismembered remains of a Gloster Meteor are also stored. The defensive structure in pictures 6 to 8 is still there, including the old metal bench and logs (not original)! The electrical fuse box is now off the wall and laying on the ground. A short distance from the "Shooting-in Butt/Engine testing shed" is another concrete emplacement I'd like to know more about. It is square in plan with typical weapon type embrasures on three sides. The "front", which faces towards the old airport building, has an embrasure maybe 3 or 4 feet wide. In front of this, inside the emplacement, is a triangular concrete block with traces of bolts and metal plates on its upper surface. These do not look strong enough to support a weapon, and the main opening seems, to me anyway, to be facing in the wrong direction for some kind of sustained fire role. In the centre of the roof there is a square hole going through to the outer surface. There are faded figures on the formerly whitewashed interior which look coeval, "V6" and "6V", which could have been some sort of location ID. I explained to my son that I thought this building could possibly have had something to do with the anti-aircraft battery that stood nearby (direction-finding or such like) or was possibly used by the Observer Corps. Its potential in a fight seems to be somewhat limited. If anyone can educate me on this I'd be most grateful. As a kid I remember the many blast shelters dotted around the site, and the old Maycrete barrack huts still standing, with the remains of iron bed frames still in them! Excellent site, by the way!

PETERTHEEATER
24-08-2011, 09:10
Fred, welcome to AiX and thanks for the first hand information on Speke, always useful.

As to the Shooting-in Butt being an Engine Test House; that is doubtful. Engine Test Houses were built on some pre-war stations for the uninstalled testing of (mainly) radial engines but were not provided on wartime build stations. But, Speke was opened in 1930 and probably had an ETH so was the original building converted to a gun test butt? Interesting possibility.

As to the defence structure in the hedgerow adjacent to the Butt, it is described on the Defence of Britain database as a Section Post. It can be seen on this site:
http://www.derelictplaces.co.uk/main/showthread.php?p=162412#post162412

Fred Dobie
30-08-2011, 10:14
Fred, welcome to AiX and thanks for the first hand information on Speke, always useful.

As to the Shooting-in Butt being an Engine Test House; that is doubtful. Engine Test Houses were built on some pre-war stations for the uninstalled testing of (mainly) radial engines but were not provided on wartime build stations. But, Speke was opened in 1930 and probably had an ETH so was the original building converted to a gun test butt? Interesting possibility.

As to the defence structure in the hedgerow adjacent to the Butt, it is described on the Defence of Britain database as a Section Post. It can be seen on this site:
http://www.derelictplaces.co.uk/main/showthread.php?p=162412#post162412

Thanks Peter, much appreciated.:-D

Fred Dobie
30-08-2011, 11:41
Further to my ramblings about Speke I have found a site with some excellent photos of the pillbox type structure I was unsure about. These can be found on http://www.28dayslater.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=56344 and http://www.28dayslater.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=52103

Greaves098
18-09-2011, 17:56
Can someone please tell me where exactly the old shooting but is, cause im desperate to go! Please!

nimrod2010
03-11-2011, 21:19
ive been looking round this site for a few years now ,after getting a ground plan of raf speke from the raf museum hendon . most of the station was on the opposite side of the airfield near banks lane , found a transformer base just like the one by the firing butt on the far side . this has something to do with refueling aircraft there is also an underground fuel tank this was still in use up until the airport closed .lots of brick debris of another building all overgrown ,ill wait till autumn to get a better look . also took my shovel and uncovered a brick foundation base at the rear of the firing butt about 40yards to the left of it

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5304/5646935657_50730cfed6.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5646935657/) raf speke (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5646935657/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3111/5860979712_5e78f5cbe8.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5860979712/) raf speke (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5860979712/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5103/5647499896_5fa37b36d4.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5647499896/) raf speke (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5647499896/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5270/5646936873_d5a5c1f106.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5646936873/) raf speke (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5646936873/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5068/5646937705_9558d20d52.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5646937705/) transformer block (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5646937705/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5270/5646938173_56d91e848f.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5646938173/) raf speke (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5646938173/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5181/5647502428_67d1ae8bb1.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5647502428/) raf speke (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/5647502428/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

PETERTHEEATER
04-11-2011, 09:04
Welcome to AiX nimrod2010 and thanks for the pictures; still a lot to be found.

carmedic
21-02-2012, 19:54
aerial view of R.A.F. Speke

http://i44.tinypic.com/25555ab.jpg

little remains of the site as it disappears under new developments and the new roads don't follow the layout of the old runways.

A is the old apron and Terminal building, now the Crowne Plaza hotel. The apron is home to the SAHG formally the Jetstream Club
B is one of the original hangars now the headquarters of the Shop Direct Group, the other can just be seen to the left of the apron
C this patch of green is part of one of the former runways which ran diagonally from bottom left to top right
D part of the perimeter track and Type B Fighter Pens
E the Shooting-in Butt

The Terminal building and tower, now the Crowne Plaza hotel
http://i40.tinypic.com/54gdo4.jpg

a10694
21-02-2012, 20:27
Midway between A, B & C is my datacentre !

a10694
21-02-2012, 20:35
There is a pillbox sort of structure somewhere around the top of the D in the middle of the grass, bunker at the top end of the trees on the right, a cold war ROC post nearby in the corner of one of the Speke Hall fields (walk right by the NT entrance gates and it's at the end)

http://www.minwex.org/phpBB3/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=35&p=52&hilit=speke#p52

ROC post location:

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=speke&hl=en&ll=53.343096,-2.870312&spn=0.001369,0.004128&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=22.297654,67.631836&hnear=Speke,+Merseyside,+United+Kingdom&t=h&z=19

The Pickett Hamilton was moved up to the RAF Millom Museum, but was moved back when it closed. I now park opposite it.

a10694
21-02-2012, 20:47
You can get very lazy leaning over the fence:

7993

One day I found a Meteor in my parking space.

7994

7995

7996

Richard Flagg
22-02-2012, 00:59
Excelent photos carmedic and a10694. For some reason, though I have never been to Liverpool I have always had a fascination about Speke, the terminal building is a lovely looking building as are those hangars. Would love to see more photos of the place, maybe one day I'll visit myself.

PETERTHEEATER
22-02-2012, 07:06
Thanks for the photo updates.

carmedic
26-02-2012, 15:36
The Pickett-Hamilton Fort

http://i40.tinypic.com/b6ecd4.jpg

and another view of the old Terminal and Tower

http://i40.tinypic.com/4q51ko.jpg

Richard Flagg
27-02-2012, 01:55
I do like that old terminal, such a nice looking building. Nice pics.

nimrod2010
08-05-2012, 22:46
hi nimrod here again the firing butt looking a bit better than it does now

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8151/7160646982_17055d3ce0.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160646982/) gaprlnwan1 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160646982/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

after spending nearly an hour throwing stones at the asbestos roof trying to make a hole in it without any luck .i came to the conclusion that the holes were caused by bullets ricocheting of the sand heep which was against the metal wall in the test butt you can also see the sand angle marker on the wall

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7086/7160633814_6b47286a53.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160633814/) SAM_0138 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160633814/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5231/7160632350_02464918f7.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160632350/) SAM_0137 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160632350/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7226/7160630830_faf8e85eb1.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160630830/) SAM_0136 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160630830/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7087/7160635414_8aba94ccf6.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160635414/) SAM_0139 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160635414/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

this building is a ww2 sleeping shelter its location is on speke hall av just before bailys lane

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7214/7160636736_c6258b5d7b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160636736/) SAM_0236 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160636736/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8146/7160639536_31120b2692.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160639536/) SAM_0238 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160639536/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7093/7160638146_27b2263793.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160638146/) SAM_0237 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160638146/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7215/7160642276_e8a55ae990.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160642276/) SAM_0240 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160642276/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7223/7160640904_954759c5dd.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160640904/) SAM_0239 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160640904/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

nimrod2010
08-05-2012, 23:06
here we can see a few buildings from raf speke this photo was taken in the seventys the radio mast was built after the war when the building changed its venue

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7212/7160645350_80c0a6860f.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160645350/) Image11a labels (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160645350/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7085/7160645162_6e60cab121.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160645162/) classflyingwherk labels (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160645162/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

this is whats left of the old mast in the above photo

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7226/7160644980_25468618d4.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160644980/) SAM_0247 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160644980/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

this is the old taxiway with the firing butt on the far right

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8163/7160643654_b45df51b51.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160643654/) SAM_0246 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160643654/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

raf speke ground plan 1945

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7079/7160646728_edb5754b05.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160646728/) raf speke 1945 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160646728/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

and last but not least our meteor was here back in the early sixtys looks like he couldnt stay away you can see the hangar in the background where its now on a10694 parking space

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5334/7160628292_836be36ea4.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160628292/) WH291Meteor (http://www.flickr.com/photos/62135055@N08/7160628292/) by nimrod 2010 (http://www.flickr.com/people/62135055@N08/), on Flickr

all plane photos credited to n.w.a.n. forum

a10694
09-05-2012, 13:39
Those are excellent. Look's like another mooch one lunch time in the woods again. I've often wondered what the ugly brick building was on Speke Hall road as well, now I know. It constantly amazes me that the wooded area still survives.

nimrod2010
10-05-2012, 20:35
check out google earth raf speke 1945 and the rootes aircraft factory

8818

Able Mabel
22-01-2013, 21:56
Been routing thro the archives at my local Town hall and was very surprised to come across a blue print, (3 actually) of the hangar which is listed as item 'B' in post #38.

I believe its late 1930s and headed as Speke aerodrome, no drawing number. Intial views of the plan(s) shows that the hangar measures some 175' x 120'.

I have ordered a copy of each plan. Interesting thing about the hangar was the roof, it appears to taper from the eaves to the centre-line at the apex in 3 stages.

When i receive my copies i will be able to post more details.

Does anybody know any other details of the said hangar or even have a copy of such ????

Viscount 701
04-08-2013, 18:18
Currently in the final stages of preparing a local magazine article off the editor on Tuesday regarding runways and last movements for the North Airfield at Liverpool. I have most information well tied down, however two little detail questions are outstanding. I'll enter more than just the questions here, to prevent being told information I already know. All three North Airfield hard runways were laid down Summer 1942, replacing former 5 grass ones.

While I am aware published runway lengths do vary a little with time due to displacing the thresholds, during the 50s to the 70s the usual published lengths are as follows:

08/26 extended August 1962 from 5,127 ft to 5,627 ft, mainly at the 08 (river) end. Closed April 82, very last use Aug '84 for aircraft movements.

04/22 length 4,187ft and closed during 1958 - anyone offer a firm date/month/season ? (A section utilised as a taxiway May 1966 until April 1982.)

17/35 length 3,192 ft, extended by around 1000 ft in early 1966 toward Speke Hall - but what was the quoted new length ?
(17/35 closed Apr 82, for all but night departures; re-designated 16/34 Nov 82, and closed Jan 84, relegated to taxiway only until August 2000)

On the South Airfield 10/28, when opened May 1966 was 7,500 ft - was re-designated Feb '73 as 09/27, the runway that remains in use today.

Richard Flagg
04-08-2013, 21:30
Be interested in the article, could we look at it with a view to publishing it in our magazine too?

Viscount 701
04-08-2013, 22:02
Ref,

The article is mainly a series of tables, linked to an airfield map. It is an extension of other timeline tables produced to help mark the 80th anniversary of Speke, 1933-2013 in '09/27' the quarterly newsletter magazine of the 'Friends of Liverpool Airport' Association.

I'll be in touch shortly by PM once I've checked that FoLA have no objection.

Richard Flagg
04-08-2013, 22:09
Ok, sounds good. Thank you

Viscount 701
29-09-2013, 14:00
There is to be an open day, hosted jointly by the 'Speke Aerodrome Heritage Group' and the 'Britannia Aircraft Preservation Trust' on the apron of the former terminal at Liverpool Speke Airport on Sunday 20th October 2013, 10am to 4 pm. While the event is primarily fund raising to support the restoration projects, it is a great opportunity to visit the site.

The aircraft will be open to the public: Avro 748, Britannia 308, Percival Prince, Jetstream 41, HS.748 cockpit and Meteor cockpit, with at regular intervals conducted tours of public parts of the Crowne Plaza Hotel (the Art Deco Airport terminal 1939-1986).

Exscouse
24-01-2014, 04:15
Reading about Speke and the Rootes aircraft factory in early WW2 reminded me that my late uncle, Jack Hill, was chief Electrician at Speke aerodrome at the outbreak of WW2. He was responsible for installing the runway lighting so that night landings could be safely made. After the war he opened and Electrical shop in Woolton opposite the baths.
Exscouse, now in Oz.

mawganmad
24-01-2014, 21:45
I only recently found out that my grandfather worked as an engineer at Rootes during the war at Speke. My dad and his family were raised in the area, nice to see pics of the remaining original structures there.

Fred Dobie
04-02-2014, 19:20
I was on what remains of the old airfield today. Factory development is moving very quickly and the defensive structure I enquired about back in August 2011 has now disappeared. I don't think it will be long before the rest of the structures become victims of progress as the work is getting very close, so scoot along ASAP if you wish to see them!

nimrod2010
05-02-2014, 21:19
hi nimrod here been along time but here we go with some classic images of the roots aircraft factory just before ww2
on the right is speke aerodrome

15632

same as the top but speke is on the left

15633

here we see raf speke in the early years you can just make out some shelters and huts

15634

this is the taxiway leading from roots to the airfield you can just make out the no2 hanger in the distance

15635

a superb view of the airfield prior to full completion

15636

still under construction

15637

how about this for a good advert the date june 1937


15638

these next few photos show the firing butt and shelters


15639

15641

15640

this mozzie was used as a weather plane apparently an old friend of mine said it use to fly to raf woodvale on a daily basis and back to speke taking atmospheric readings
it also starred in the film mosquito squadron,its now residing in the de haviland museum painted in wartme colours

15645

this image shows raf speke of banks lane to the right you can see the shelters
in the center you can see two houses on the corner of a v shaped bend which are present in the next few photos
15646

an Arial view of raf speke to the right on the bend our two houses

15647
this was the original entrance to the airfield before the main terminal was built in the top right hand corner our two houses again
just by the entrance you can see a small block of houses .I SHALL RETURN TO THESE HOUSES IN THE FUTURE

15648

nimrod2010
05-02-2014, 23:02
the thumbnail print above was the old pillbox which was located down by the old sailing club

Viscount 701
06-02-2014, 20:41
Not very impressed with 'Nimrod's' post above, although the images collected are interesting.

Six of the photos, at least, come from other forums. Three are photos that I digitised and posted - there should at least be a credit to the source from which they were removed. One of the others was posted on nwan forum by a fellow administrator of that site, while the another is credited to a friend, but has been 'lifted' from Airliner.net - a site that has a reputation for taking unkindly to photos being reproduced without specific permission. incidentally, the control tower under construction shot is not a 1930's colour original, but digitally shaded by Graham Ward editor of Friends of Liverpool Airport Association's newsletter '09/27'. The shot of the 20 or so Halifax aircraft outside Rootes (note correct spelling) factory comes from Phil Butler's 'LJLA-An Illustrated History' Tempus 2008 p.182 where it is fully credited as to the sources.

To cap it all, the captions are weak and don't use the expertise of the source. The Mosquito is a THum Flt aircraft of the late '50s, correctly stated as calling at Speke on the way back to RAF Woodvale to drop off Met recordings. It has no connection to the Mosquito acquired by Liverpool City during the '60s and flown during the filming of 'Mosquito Squadron'. On the site from which the photos originated there are detailed threads on both subjects, so an easily avoided error with a little research. Equally on another photo (source not known) it captions early years of RAF Speke, yet there are three hard runways, not five grass, so after summer 1942, by which time the MSFU was the only front line still at RAF Speke. See the top post of page 6 of this thread for the runway build dates, so again could provide real information with a little basic checking.

While I can do little about viewers 'copy and pasting' images for their own use, I do feel it very wrong when they are repeated elsewhere without at least some effort to provide due credit to the source. This is a public post rather than a PM to the AIX administrators, as I know that this is not AIX's fault, but it is the responsibility of the poster to ensure that 'intellectual ownership' of images is at least acknowledged.

Not a post I am happy having to make, I leave it upto the AIX administration team whether they delete all three posts, warn 'Nimrod' or ignore this sensitive issue, so possibly sending the wrong signal to others.

PETERTHEEATER
07-02-2014, 05:16
Thanks Viscount 701 for pointing out the anomalies.

Dave Smith
07-02-2014, 10:25
In defence of Nimrod, I would imagine that he was probably unaware of the niceties of crediting photos where appropriate, but is now! The fact that he has come up with some excellent aerial photos which are new to me at least, rather makes up for his indiscretions. The web is a minefield for copyright issues. If you don't want a particular photo to do the rounds it's best not to post it anywhere. Some of mine occasionally pop up on the web, not always properly credited, but nobody is making any money out of them so I don't have a problem with it. They just add to the historical record. That's my rather liberal view anyway.

nimrod2010
07-02-2014, 23:53
thanks vicount for the input ill just take time out to explain why i did not give any credit to the images i put on the AIX .
any user who clicked on to the image was to be directed to the website from where it originated .unfortunately my pc
did not do this ,after reading your message my son quickly remedied the fault on my pc .if Ive upset you or any of your
friends in any way i am sorry
regarding the mozzie my caption said an old friend he was adamant this was the weather version that flew out of
Liverpool again he was wrong
as for my spelling of roots sorry rootes i hold my hands up i was wrong
as for the the images i don't say much on the captions i believe pictures speak louder than words
on the other hand lets not get serious with warnings lets keep it enjoyable , seeing as you now a lot about raf speke
any chance of sharing info with us after all this is info exchange

jbmack
22-02-2014, 11:32
http://www.britishpathe.com/video/great-seaport-now-great-airport

From NWAN site.

myaix1943
07-04-2014, 21:34
Maybe a question for bus enthusiasts but... Has anyone information about this strange streamlined bus that operated between Speke and the city centre in the 1930s. Certainly a rare looking beast and likely to have been a unique one off. Only info is its registration - AKC 800. Bears a logo and the legend LIVERPOOL AIRPORT on its side.

16195

16196

JV (that's me...)